Minutes

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Rules and Ordinance Subcommittee Minutes 8/15/22 
 Call to order 
 Ruggiero – introduces the goals for tonight and the timeline moving forward 
o Committee to develop a strategy and report back to Council by second
October meeting 
 Public Comment 
o Bill Schmidt, P5 
 Submits correspondence in person and via email (attached) 
 Discusses how the ORC was out of typical process 
 Town Charter Section 1-8 
 Does not believe that the interests of the committee
represent the interests of the Town and the Council is a
much more representative body as it is elected 
o Karin Chavis, P2 
 Disappointed that there are only three councilors at the meeting. 
 Councilor Munson 
o Addresses the comments made by Bill Schmidt 
o Recommends reviewing the ORC document from the prior ORC to make
sure that it is given its due diligence 
 Councilor DeMarco 
o Committee was put together and does not believe we are making a
decision on this document 
o Has a hard time saying that we know better than the people of Winthrop 
 Councilor Munson 
o We are discussing process… 
o The process asks us as Councilors to weigh in based on what is written in
the Charter 
o Would like to see the written K&P opinion allowing for the ORC on the
off cycle 
o The charter asks us, as the R&O Committee to be the first filter on this 
o We are in this position because we are elected to be on this and represent
the people 
o This deserves its due diligence, and if something fails in R&O another
Councilor can make the motion independently at the full Council level 
 Ruggiero explains the difference between charter and ordinance recommendations 
o Charter amendments need to be voted on by the Council, the State
Legislature and the Public 
o Ordinance changes can be handled in-house 
 Honan 
o We are elected Councilors, and these Charter amendments were sent to the
R&O Committee. We were elected to serve the Town in these ways. We
are elected to vote on each issue 
 DeMarco

o Understands each side of this and sees himself as a representative of the
people and doesn’t know what exactly the people want here and is trying
to figure it out. 
 Councilor Belcher 
o There was coverage in the Transcript on this. There will be public
comment 
o If we put everything up to a vote of the public we would be back to a
Town Meeting style of government 
 Councilor DeMarco 
o Asks Councilor Ruggiero how he voted on each recommendation during
the ORC 
 Councilor Ruggiero 
o Runs through his votes during the ORC at the request of colleague 
 Councilor DeMarco 
o Would make an amendment to make it apply the recall to only 4 year
terms, not 2 year terms 
 Councilor Ruggiero 
o Advises the Committee to think of this holistically. Cannot look at each
recommendation in a vacuum 
 Councilor Munson 
o Asks if we can adjust these recommendations 
o How many opportunities can the public review this? 
 Councilor DeMarco 
o We can ask the transcript to get involved 
 Councilor Ruggiero 
o Explains the public comment up to this point. Councilor Ruggiero –
according to Council President we can make any amendmentto any
recommendation. The document is listed on the front page of the Town
websiste, all ORC meetings were public, all R&O meetings are public and
all TC meetings are public. 
o We can ask anyone to come view/listen to any meeting 
 Councilor Belcher 
o The spirit of this is to decided on what has been presented and not to re-
write the entire document 
 Councilor Ruggiero advises committee that during each meeting if we cover a
topic, there needs to be some restraint to going back to a topic at another meeting
unless it is relevant and necessary because the document is very dense and we
have a timeline to adhere to. 
 Recall provision discussion 
o Councilor Munson 
 There seems to be undue power for one person to run a campaign 
o Councilor DeMarco 
 There needs to be serious outrage on a decision 
 At the same time believes that a recall keeps councilors in line 
o Councilor Munson 
 The recall on a 2 year doesn’t make much sense all together

o Councilor Ruggiero 
 Explains the background of the recall provision discussions at the
council meeting 
o Councilor DeMarco 
 Believes that many council presidents past have been against a
recall provision 
 Closing Remarks 
o Councilor Munson 
 Would like to see a reason for why we even have the need to take
up this document and not refer to prior ORC 
 Would like to do a side by side of all of the Towns with recalls 
 Would like a list of all the current 4 year terms so that we can
make better decisions on this 
o Councilor Belcher 
 Marc had made some comments at the Council meeting regarding
some of Councilor Munson’s questions 
 Let’s ask ourselves if these “actively solve a problem” 
 Public Comment 
o Bill Schmidt, P5 
 Agrees with Councilor Belcher 
 The Council is much more representative of the people than the
ORC 
 Makes the point that the vote would also need to go to the state
legislature 
 Suggests for the Councilors to vote their conscious, that is what
they are here to do 
 Should vote on each recommendation separately but in an order
that makes sense 
 Most communities do not have a recall process 
 Free speech v ethics 
o Karin Chavis, P2 
 Disappointed Councilor Ruggiero is offering his opinion 
 The order of the recommendations was the order that they appear
in the Charter itself